Final score 18-16. Tough loss but hard fought game. We led much of the game but just couldn't hang on there in the end. As with most games, there is always good and bad. I'll start with the good:
1. Good defense: All in all a very good effort. Thought we did a pretty good job of mixing things up and disguising blitzes. By in large the DBs did pretty well. Kerrigan was better than I thought in pass coverage as he had to run with Witten which is hard for even the best cover LBs. I felt like this group did enough for us to win the game.
2. Good O line play: Dallas likes to attack and send at least 7 guys in the box. Again, for much of the game, Rexy had time to throw. Running game was okay. Looked like it was getting better as the game went on which is what you hope for/expect.
3. Gano: Made all the kicks that he could including a 50 yarder. His kickoffs were all deep and to the left. He did a lot this game to better entrench him as the kicker.
4. Dirty 30: World of difference with him out there. He's fast and aggressive and made a number of plays that Doughty would have no chance at making. He's a force and certainly makes our defense that much better.
5. Coaching: This one is debatable. However, outside a few questionable calls, I was happy with the coaching. We committed to the run and had good balance. I was comfortable with the coaching, we just need to execute better.
Now for the bad:
1. Rexy: He wasn't horrible but I can't say that he was good. He looked tentative out there and looked like he was lacking his confidence and didn't seem to have much zip on his passes. His INT was horrible. Not only did it seem like he didn't see Lee but the pass was soft and underthrown...an easy pick. His fumbles are annoying. When he scrambles, he is SO concerned about getting hit and he keeps looking back. Just tuck the freaking ball and run! Even on the play in the 4th where it looked like he fumbled but they just called it a sack, he wrapped the ball up but he lets go of it and puts his hands down to brace for the fall. He has to hold on to the ball! Still, it wasn't a horrible game by him. He did have some nice passes but we needed him to do a little more. Come up with one or two more plays and he couldn't do it. Again, I am more bothered with what I thought was apprehension and lack of confidence in him.
2. 3rd and 21 call: I REALLY didn't like the all out blitz. I could deal with it on 2nd down but I was saying to myself that on 3rd down Romo will have isolation on a WR and just throw a fly for a jump ball. When we were showing it, I was REALLY hoping we were faking and guys would back out of it in coverage. The blitz was high risk/high reward and we didn't get immediate pressure and Romo backed up a fair amount and rolled out and 9 times out of 10 the WR will make that play. People are all on D. Hall but that is a very difficult play for a DB to make.
3. Turf: What was up with the turf? Our RBs were slipping left and right. They couldn't cut and it clearly affected some of our runs.
4. Muffed snap: The botched snap could have been the difference in the game. Rocca is proving to be a very good punter but the botched snap hurt. In a close game, a FG can be the difference and that one hurt.
5. Skins fans: I have already mentioned that Rexy wasn't great but was watching some Comcast post game and the texts coming in were ridiculous. Before the game, the texts were super supportive of the Skins and some for Rexy but after it was all doom and gloom. Get rid of Rexy and D. Hall and this and that. It's great that Skins fans are passionate but by and large they are idiots.
It was a tough loss. We had a chance to get a tough divisional win on the road and move to 3-0 but it wasn't to be. Romo did a great job of directing the victory. He had a lot of adversity with WRs not knowing where to line up and an inept C who fell prey to the defense barking fake snaps and releasing the ball when Romo wasn't ready. It's too bad that just one of those bad snaps didn't go our way. Still, we fought hard and guys really seemed upset with the loss. I like that. There is an expectation to win that we have not seen in some time. I thought Rexy was a little too down. In the post game press conference, he looked really upset. He, along with the team, is going to have to pick themselves up and get ready for St. Louis on a short week.
St. Louis has been pretty disappointing this season as I think many people expected them to be an improved team. They are coming off of a Ravens thrashing so I imagine they will be pumped up. Basically, have to dust this one off and move forward.
HAIL SKINS!!!
52 comments:
The agony of defeat...Despite telling myself over and over again that I have no expectations and simply being competitive is enough this season, losing like that really hurts. I didn't sleep well last night because I kept seeing Rexy fumbling the ball away in my head.
Your points sum it up. We played a hard fought game where we clearly were highly competitive. The game was winnable, which really is encouraging. The muffed snap and Rexy's turnovers did us in. Some blame needs to go on Haslett for the all out blitz on 3rd and 21, but for the most part, the D was rock solid. We should have won.
It's a tough pill to swallow, but if we can get to the bye at 3-1, I'll be extremely happy. We're going to see how mentally tough this team is in the next six days. If we can go into St. Louis and beat a struggling Rams team in what is setting up to be a trap game, we'll be in good shape to come out of the bye with the confidence needed to take on the Iggles at home.
Let's see what happens. HAIL SKINS!
Oh yeah. And to add to the heartbreak, the first thing my son asked me this morning when I saw him was, "What was the score?" When I told him, the look of disappointment on his face was enough to even make Robs shed a tear. I'm glad to see my boy becoming a bigger and bigger fan, but winning is the only thing that makes becoming a fan worthwhile. It may sound a bit ridiculous, but I hope for my son's sake we have a good season so he can have a reason to be a fan.
Yeah, Haslett is to blame for the all out blitz. It didn't make sense. I didn't like it from the get go. They should have had nickel or dime coverage and allowed Kerrakpo to rush. They probably get 7 or 8 yards and it sets up a 4th and long. That is what the Puckers did to the Pears. When they were faced with a 3rd and long, they had more DBs and Cutler wasn't able to see anything down field. It was a mistake. Really didn't like that call. Also, Romo knew exactly what he was going to do with the ball and had adjusted given that we just called that play on 2nd down. Again, if you don't get immediate rush, you are going to be in trouble and you can't expect Hall to make that play because more often than not, the receiver will win that battle.
Good points on the Rams being a trap game and finding out the Skins resolve to come back from a loss like that. We need that game if we intend to do anything this season. It's an away game and the Rams will certainly be upset after their thrashing. Grossman has to pick himself up and lead this team.
Good to hear about your son taking more of an interest in the Skins. When my son went to bed, he told me to tell him who won when he first woke up. Sadly, he was disappointed.
A couple of other things. We were just a play or two away from winning that game. We just couldn't find that play. I am going to mention again because it is so disappointing that Rexy has to hold on to the ball. When he is scrambling, he has got to quit looking behind him and just tuck and run. Protect the freaking ball and move forward. Whatever. On to St. Louis.
HAIL SKINS!!!
I am crying over the disappointment your sons felt this morning. Let me wipe away the tears . . . there now I am ready to comment.
I thought the Deadskins played a fairly good game overall. However, they were playing a team that was clearly depleted at WR and with a horribly bad offensive line - particularly center. The dude did not actually know when to snap the ball.
I was amazed at how often the WRs didn't seem to know what to do. I was particularly disappointed in Kevin Ogletree - Cavs should know better.
I think too much was made of Romo and his ribs - that really wasn't that much trouble for him. I think the injury that Cassel played through was much worse.
The Deadskins beat a depleted Giants team and a very weak Cards team (barely) - both at home. They played OK last night, but it is still hard for me to judge. If they go on the road to St. Louis and win things will be OK for the season. If they lose - which is really what I expect - then they are pretty much the same as last year. We'll see.
Rexy continues to be what we thought he was. He's a courageous little dude who makes a bunch of good plays that are offset by inopportune turnovers. I didn't get a chance to appreciate his attitude until he became our QB, but I've learned to love his leadership and ability to shake off his mistakes. I have complete confidence that the fumble won't affect him next week. The problem is, I don't have confidence that he'll avoid making a few more mistakes next week. All we can do is hope the mistakes don't cost us the game.
Again, 3-1 will be great. It's not unrealistic to believe we can be 3-1 considering how the D is playing and the discipline, coaching, and leadership we have. Let's just hope we can regroup and play to our potential next week against a team that it looks like we should beat.
HAIL SKINS!
I appreciate the fact that Robs can show some emotion and understand how the outcome affected my son. Go ahead and cry it out Robs. Don't hold back.
I agree with Robs that it's still hard to tell what the Skins are. I don't think the Cowgirls were as depleted as Robs makes them out to be though. The only key player that was out was Austin. Obviously Romo, Bryant, and Jones were able to play at a high level.
Even though the Rams aren't that good right now, next week will tell us a lot. Seeing what I've seen thus far, I believe we are a better team and we should win.
I assume the Cowgirl O-line will start to gel and get better - especially at center.
I don't know how bad it was for Dez and Felix, but what I saw was a team that pretty much sucked (the Cowgirls) offensively - they looked inept - continuously make plays against a Deadskin D.
I found the Deadskin coaching (all out blitz at the end which you guys described) and the offensive play calling (where were the runs that were fairly effective late in the game) to be suspect.
Where was Fred Davis? Cooley running the ball? WTF? Arsenio Hall got turned around and he has been beat badly in all three games this year. O.J. Atogwe seems slow and Landry has never been much good in coverage. So physically they have some limitations in their secondary.
It doesn't seem to me that the Deadskins are very good and I think the Rams game will be a good test of where they really are. A weak team that they are playing on the road is a must game if they are going to fight to get to 7-9 this year. Their schedule does not look good this year if they lose to the Rams this week.
Dude. What the hell were you watching? The secondary was awesome just about the entire game. The only reason why the Cowgirls scored anything in the 2nd half was because Jones was able to rip off a bunch of long runs to get them in field goal range. We held them to 3-13 on 3rd down conversions. Romo's passer rating was 70.9. We held him in check except for that one play at the end. I have nothing to complain about regarding the D except for Haslett's blitz call on 3rd and 21.
The Cowgirls have a lot of talent on D. Our O needs to be more effective in the redzone, but I have very little issue with the play-calling. I didn't like handing off to Cooley the 2nd time on 3rd and short, but we basically took with we were given, which should have been enough to win.
Classic Robs not giving the Skins ANY credit. If we win, it's because the other team sucked. If we lose, it's because we suck. That, in a nutshell, is Robs Redskin analysis.
As Deepie pointed out the Cowboys WR corps was only missing Austin. Not sure how that corps was depleted. To me, the issues they had at WR and O line was poor coaching on the Cowboys part. Just a plain lack of discipline.
As far as beating a depleted Giants, it's largely the same Giants team that beat the Rams by 12 points and the Eagles by 13 points so don't care much for that. As far as beating the Cards (barely), I'm not going to apologize for any wins. A win is a win is a win. I don't care if you win by 1 or 101...it's a win.
As we all seem to agree, we didn't like the blitz call. The running game seemed to be better in the second half. We got aggressive with short passes in the fourth qtr and I didn't have too much of a problem with that. The Cowboys were expecting run as they figured we would try and run out the clock. I didn't mind the short passes at all. Even Gruden said that he loved the aggressiveness. You won't please everyone with playcalling. It's a catch 22. If you pass and incomplete it, people with say, why didn't they run it and knock time off the clock. If you run it and are stuffed, people will say, that is what the Cowboys were expecting and we should've been more aggressive. By in large, I didn't have a problem with the offensive play calling.
I have no problem with Atogwe or Landry. Thought the two of them had solid games, particularly Landry. If you want to see slow safeties look at your own Pears (see Steltz trying to get over to Finley - not happening). Landry had no issues in coverage so your comment on him is meaningless.
As mentioned, and I would think you would agree, that D. Hall left out on an island against Bryant on an all out blitz, is not fair. Nearly every CB will be at a disadvantage in that situation. Don't tell me that Revis or Asomugha would have gotten that. In fact, Asomugha is having his own issues right not in Philly. 6' 2" 220 lbs has the advantage over 5' 10" 190 every day. It was the call. I blame Haslett more than Hall. D. Hall really doesn't get the credit because he runs his mouth but the guy is a solid CB that I'm sure the Pears would love to have.
Cooley was forced to play some FB because of Darrell Young being out. He ran the ball twice (once for a first down) so not sure what your problem is with that. It wasn't like he was lined up at FB the entire game.
No one on this blog has ever said the Skins were unbelievable. However, it was another solid performance and for me again, this season I just wanted to see guys compete and we saw that yesterday. As we improve, the wins will come.
Deepie, Robs is literally just in hate mode. His analysis and comments are useless.
Seeing this from a neutral standpoint.
D Hall needs to shut up and play better. You cant come out btchin and complaining as if you didnt know what was coming. He knew the call was all out blitz and that he would be one on one with Dez Bryant. It was his fault that he got beat by a superior reciever. And good thing to. Hes freakin annoying and extremely over-rated. hopefully this shuts him up. also it was a bad call. i cant understand why Hasslet doesnt go into a formation with more defensive backs covering the field.
Watching Romo navigate through a meteor storm of injuries, miscues and mess ups, and still put together a victory was amazing. It was Favresque. He def has a new found respect in my mind. Especially doing this two weeks in a row. He looked like a true leader out there. That in essence is why the QB position is the most important. If you have a good QB it doesnt matter what the rest of the Team is. youll have a chance at winning. (Peyton Manning and the Colts vs no peyton mannning and the colts = world of difference. redskins failed at finding a decent QB. On a side note, way to go Jason Campbell. Sacked only twice in 3 games, and just came off a victory against the vaunted jets. Im happy for him and am rooting for him.
It was shocking that the skins couldnt pull off this win despite poor play from the cowboys and their many many mistakes and misfortunes. 4 Bad snaps, poor receiver play and basically an inept Cowboy offense. The Cowboys were basically saying Here take this victory we dont want it.
The offensive line is clearly a concern. There is no running game because the Offensive line cant run block. And the Pass protection broke down in the 4th quarter of the game when Demarcus Ware began terrorizing Grossman which led to two fumbles. one which wasnt called, and the other ending the Game.
Where were Grossman's best receivers? Besides Moss, i dont think any of them even had a catch or their names even called. Did Fred Davis even play?
All in all it was poor play from both teams. It would have been a bore for 3 hours if not for Romo's heroics. (could beck be the next Romo? i say lets find out. Cant say that Beck wouldnt have or couldnt have especially since weve never even seen what Beck actually has)
Finally, Rex Grossman isnt the answer. Two fumbles, and an INT and doesnt have the awareness to cover the damn ball when feeling the pressure and running away from it. He cost them the game with a turnover in the end.
Shanahan doesnt have time to draft a QB next year and develop him into a winner to the liking of Danny.
The Rams are 0-3. They will be hungry to win. Lets see how improved this Skins team really is.
I personally dont think they will be able to beat the Rams this sunday. if they cant win this weekend, 7-9 seems to be on the more optimistic side. The Rams and the Cowboys are games that they have to win to balance out the tougher second half of the season.
BTW - Robs, what did Atogwe do to make him seem slow to you? The commentators actually said he was a good pick up. I have no problem with him.
JSR sounds like Robs Junior. Looks like he also missed the fact that this was a defensive struggle between division rivals who ALWAYS play close games like this one was.
JSR, what in the world are you talking about? Where do I begin with you?
Regarding D. Hall, the only thing I will agree with you on is that he should pipe down. I'm telling you, in that situation, if you don't get pressure quickly, the offense/WR has by far the advantage and will/should almost always complete the pass. In a WIDE open field in one on one, the DB will almost never be able to make the play. I could go on and on about this.
Regarding Romo and being "Favresque." First leave it to you to pull out some Favre stuff. It was a good performance. What is more disconcerting if you are a Cowboy fan is how ill prepared that team is. We are in Week 4 and those guys look like they just showed up to camp.
Your comment "If you have a good QB it doesnt matter what the rest of the Team is. youll have a chance at winning." Not true. You really need an O line and WRs. You then mentioned JC and how he is having some success now. It's because he has some support which he didn't when he was in DC.
I was fine with the O line. Dallas is very good against the run and Ware is arguably the best pass rusher in the league and he was largely shut down for most of the game. At the end, he can pin his ears back and rush because everyone knew we were in hurry up and going to pass.
Where were the receivers? "Besides Moss, i dont think any of them even had a catch or their names even called." What are you talking about? Gaffney had 5 catches for 60 yards. Cooley had 4 catches for 41 yards. Hightower had 5 catches for 39 yards. Then a couple of other guys had catches. The ball was spread around.
Rexy wasn't terrible. It's just that he has to hold on to the ball. His fumbles are killers. His INT was bad. However, he still made some nice plays/passes. I just hope he learns. Again, I also didn't like what appeared to me a lack of confidence on his part.
Rams is a big game. It's away but it's a must win game and would be a huge victory for us going into the bye week.
Close game or not. The Skins were handed this game. It was theirs for the taking. Good teams don't fumble away victories (literally and figuratively).
Not sure how you can say that they were handed this game. It was a defensive battle. We certainly had opportunities to win the game but I wouldn't say that we were handed the game.
The game was going to come down to who was going to make that one or two plays that would win it. It ended up being the Cowboys that found those couple of plays.
Man, don't you guys have work to do?
The D played very well except for a few mistakes.
I think Rexy is not looking like the confident passer that he was in game one and the second half of game two. I'm not sure what his deal is and why the Redskins receivers appeared to be covered so well. It's kind of funny, but with the first two games, people were making comments about how open these receivers were.
Although, I liked the two or three plays that Cooley either ran it or ran a pass route from the middle, I don't think this is a long term solution. We need Young back at FB. It's surprising that Sellers hardly go in there.
Overall, QB play in Q4, better coaching against our Offense and the home field made the difference.
That’s the point. D Hall is not going to make that play. He is beligerant and over rated and his coaches think hes something that he clearly is not ( a one on one shutdown corner who can make a play). If haslett doesn’t think that then why put him in that position. More so, it is irresponsible for haslett to just all out blitz with no back up plan. If its predetermined that the corner is always going to lose in that one on situation, then why even have a corner back there or take the risk of giving up a TD or Big completion?
I agree with you that the Cowboys seemed unprepared. But that gives even more credit to Romo for still being able to pull together a win. It also discredits the skins further. For not being able to win against an unprepared opponent.
There is no doubt you need an O line and WR’s to be successful long term (16 games and the playoffs) but my point is that with an exceptional QB (Manning, Brady, Rodgers, Favre, Young, Elway, Rothberger, Rivers) you have a chance at winning any single game no matter what the situation. As proven by Romo last night. I don’t think hes a hall of fame qb by any means but hes a good QB. Something the Skins Lack. Sure you can win without an exceptional QB (Aikman, Rypien, Dilfer, Matt Ryan, Sanchez, Flacco) but you have to have a superb supporting cast (O line, WR, RBs)
Ok Gaffney had 5 catches for 60 yrds. Hardly impactful. The other two you mentioned are not receivers. One is a tight end who was playing full back and the other is the Running back. Even still, 39 yards and 41 yrds are meager numbers. Not a good showing from the Receiving corp. Or more so worthy of the title “best receivers”
Rexy lost the game for them. His inability to make plays and his lack of awareness lost the game for them. He fumbled which sealed their loss. That to me is terrible.
They said Otagwe was a good pickup - I remember hearing that. He is good on paper.
Gruden also said when you see Landry without his shirt on it makes you want to do situps. JKSD, does it make you want to do situps?
We'll see about their secondary, but it has given up big plays at critical times in all three games.
The Cowboys found ways to make plays? Yeah, they did even though they pretty much handed the Deadskins about 10 plays in the game because of an inability to snap the ball or for receivers to know what they were supposed to be doing.
There really isn't much to fuss about - we just differ on what we saw last night. I think we can all agree on this - if the Deadskins lose to the 0-3 Rams this week - especially if they get torched by Bradford - it is not going to be a very good sign.
Agree with most of Deepie and JKS's D. Just want to add that the game sucked tutti. We couldn't recover one...just one of those early snapped balls? When Kerrigan forced Romo to fumble it bounces right back in his hands? The one bad snap that went back 20 yards and the ball just bounces up in Romo's hands again? WTF? Lucky as balls.
Matar makes a great point...Not about the tutti, but about the botched snaps bouncing right back into Homo's hands. It's pretty crazy that he was able to recover the ball and make something out of nothing repeatedly. Homo apparently is good at grabbing balls that are flopping around.
I don't think Rex lost the game. I thought he made some nice throws out there, but there was pressure that he had to deal with. He made enough plays to give his team a chance.
The thing that really lost this game was poor coaching. Horrible call by Haslet on 3rd and 21 late in the game. Frankly, I thought the Deadskins seemed to abandon the run in a close game unnecessarily, but then they did not call Fred Davis' number at all that I recall. You have to get that guy involved.
I agree Rex should have been more aware that he was going to get hit and stripped of the ball at the end - they still had a chance. But I thought he put up some good numbers against a fairly tough D. He certainly moved the ball well.
If Sav Rocca doesn't drop the snap and Ga-NOOOOOO! hits that one field goal maybe they win. If Arsenio doesn't suck so bad on 3rd and 21 maybe they win. Blaming Rex doesn't seem to make much sense given all the other things that went wrong.
Deeps - you know all about Homo's ability to grab your nuts. Now you just need to teach Rex how to do it.
STFU Arsenio!
Nothing like complaining after a game. Typical of Arsenio.
What did Atogwe do that makes you believe he is slow? Do you have any reason to say that or is it just your opinion?
WTF does them saying Landry with his shirt off makes you want to do sit ups have to do with anything?
I LOVE IT!!! Robs will blame everyone else EXCEPT for Rex! What is with your love affair with that dude, man? HILARIO!!!!
Ifs, would'ves, could'ves don't mean anything. We came out with the loss. If Rexy doesn't fumble the ball away. If Rexy doesn't throw that ridonkulous INT, maybe we win. Doesn't matter.
Robs, do you really believe D. Hall is to blame on the 3rd and 21 play? Do you really believe that WRs and DBs have an even chance on that kind of play? Just wondering what you think. It's fine if you don't like D. Hall but trying to understand your level of objectivity and football sense.
FYI - Davis did get a 20+ yard completion.
It is my impression. He doesn't seem to make any plays that I notice.
Your "evidence" that O.J. is a good pickup is that the MNF guys said he was. So I told you something else the MNF guys said and wonder if you agree or if you are just selective and biased toward things you only agree with.
I don't absolve Rex, but for folks to simply blame Rex because he fumbled on the final drive is silly. That is all I am pointing out. I am commenting in response to some of the comments above.
I think Arsenio f'ed up pretty badly on the play. Just like Steltz f'ed up on the third TD catch by Jermichael Finlay. Who cares if DBs are at a disadvantage? This is the NFL and you have to think about the situation and play the man appropriately. Arsenio got all turned around and then compounded the play by trying to tackle Bryant up high and catching the facemask.
He can blame the coaches and the ref all he wants, but he needs to take some responsibility also and STFU.
Don't remember the catch, but they should have gone to him more.
Atogwe is a HUGE upgrade over Moore and Doughty. He made a big play knocking the ball out of the WR's hands in the end zone. He got over there quickly and made the play. He made 6 tackles. He has been one of the better turnover guys in the league the last couple of years. Maybe he wasn't in on every play yesterday or his name wasn't called out enough but for you to say the only "evidence" on why I like him is because of the MNF guys saying something and then comparing the Landry shirt off comment is just silly. Terrible comment.
Do you think Rexy played well? His INT was terrible. His inabilities to hold on to the ball are a real concern. He made some nice throws and I am certainly not one of these guys calling for his head. However, I am not going to say that he had a great game and that he shouldn't take some blame for the loss.
I really don't blame D. Hall for that play. When we didn't get pressure and you leave a CB on an island with a WR with that kind of space and you saw Romo direct Bryant where to go (cut inside), it's not a surprise that he got spun around. It would have happened to nearly all CBs. The CBs don't have the luxury of looking at the QB and knowing where the ball is going.
As far as his comments, he's frustrated. He is a guy that plays with passion and he was frustrated. That's all. I would prefer he keep quiet but he doesn't. It's like Rexy saying to everyone that we are going to win the East. You prefer he keeps that within the locker room but he is passionate. I don't have a real problem with that. I don't think D. Hall like the call from Haslett. I also don't think he is the only guy on the team that didn't like that call. However, I really don't believe Hall has any deeper issue with Haslett. He just spoke out of passion. No problem with that.
Between Cooley and Davis they had like 5-6 catches for 60+ yards. I'm fine with that. So what that Davis didn't get as many catches. Cooley got more this week. No problem.
Bottom line, it was a good, competitive game that we almost won on the road. I was happy that we competed hard and to be 2-1 at this point in the season, I am happy with that.
O.J. didn't do anything that I saw.
I think Rex was fine.
That call was bad but Arsenio did not make a play on a ball he could have made a play on and then he compounded the problem by tackling high and getting the facemask.
Arsenio should STFU. He isn't acting like a leader, he is making excuses and looking like a jackass.
Davis should be targeted more.
We'll know the bottom line in a couple of weeks. Is this a bump in the road or the beginning of the end? We'll soon find out how costly this one is.
We spoke on the phone and it was clear that you didn't watch the entire game and clearly didn't watch the play Atogwe made to break up the TD. For you to judge someone without even watching is just ridiculous.
Rex was okay. I can kind of accept the bad INT but the inability to hold on to the ball is a REAL problem that has plagued him his entire career. He has to learn to protect the ball. We had a chance to win in the end and he lost it. It's not once or twice. It's been a problem his entire career. I know you love him but you should probably even recognize that. It's something that if not corrected can cost us games.
I thought we agreed on the phone that that was a very difficult play for D. Hall. Watch the replay again. Kerrigan who was meant to rush came in but backed off once he didn't get immediate pressure. Romo backs up deep, rolls right, and points Bryant to the middle of the field. It's an easy play for the QB and WR. I keep saying that that is a VERY difficult position to be in for a CB and not many (if any) can make a play on that ball. We even agreed on the phone that that is basic backyard football. As far as the facemask, you think that was intentional? First, I'm not even sure he grabbed the facemask so much as put his hand on the mask and then immediately took it away. I didn't see a grab. Fine, they called it. I could see it being called either way. It's not like I had a problem with the call but he didn't intend for that to happen. It was an unfortunate incident. It happens in football games regularly.
As mentioned, prefer Hall pipe down but I don't have a real problem with his comments. Again, he is passionate. He was frustrated. He doesn't have a grudge against Haslett. It's been said and it's over and done with and it's time to move on to St. Louis. No big deal.
Rexy spread the ball to several receivers with multiple guys getting 4 or more catches (Moss, Gaffney, Cooley, Hightower). Again, the ball is getting to the TE. Whether it is Cooley or Davis is not a big deal. Cooley only had I believe one catch each in the previous games with Davis getting the bulk of the work. They are both very good TEs so it doesn't matter to me which one gets the ball. Seriously, dude, what's the difference?
We will find out what this team is made up of on Sunday. Each week we find out a little bit more about each team and this will be a good test against a team people expected to be much improved this year and has thus far been a disappointment. They will no doubt be angry about the thrashing they took and Spags job will start coming into question if they lose back to back home games and start the season 0-4.
I can have an opinion on O.J. just as you have opinions about the Bears without watching any of the games.
We'll see how O.J. plays. He had the defensive holding that wiped out the Rob Jackson (is that his name) sack and gave the Cowboys their first down inside the 5. You point to one play and I can point to one play also.
As for everything else, we'll see.
So you're arguing just for the sake of arguing. Robs...you just admitted that you're not paying attention to the facts and that your opinion is completely baseless. I rest my case.
More B.S. from Robs. I have watched a Pear game (the Packer game). I have shaped my opinion of the Pears on their record, what I saw, the stats that show they are the second worst rushing team in the league (poor O line), they have given up the most sacks in the league (poor O line), they are 26th in pass defense (secondary issues), what I read. Martz is an egomaniacal arse that is hell bent on calling the game his way (too many passes) and not even allowing Jeff Cutler to audible out of the play.
Apparently you shape your opinion on one holding call. Now I understand how your analysis is typically worth shat.
Atogwe is a solid player and certainly much better than what we had. Look at his stats. Over the last 4 years, he has had 18 INTs, 11 forced fumbles, 6 fumble recoveries, 31 passes defended. Those are pretty decent numbers but I guess you want to shape your opinion on one holding call in a game that you partially watched. Nice.
I've watched more Deadskins and read more about your team than either of you have with respect to the Bears. Rather than getting into a foolish pissing contest now, we'll see who ends up being right in coming weeks.
We're not talking about the Skins and Pears. You are changing the subject.
We are talking about your ridiculous assessment of Atogwe based on one play in a game you partially watched.
As far as watching and reading more about Redskins than us watching/reading about the Pears makes sense...we live in D.C. Of course we are going to get more coverage of the Skins than Pears.
Whatever dude. Change the subject if you want. Form your opinions on one play. That is why it is hard to take your "analysis" seriously.
Jeez, do I have to spell it out for you so explicitly? I know as much about O.J. as you know about the Bears O-line.
My comment about our relative understanding and first hand experience watching games favors me - NOT YOU.
We'll see if O.J. is a difference maker or if he reverts to the terrible play of Arsenio and the horrible coverage skills of Landry.
Changing the subject . . . heh, heh, heh. If you don't follow the discussion then ask - but commenting on our observations and reading up on the team is directly relevant to our ability to comment on the Bears and Deadskins.
JEEZ, I guess you do need to spell it out. You knew nothing about Atogwe. You formed an opinion based on one play in a game you partially watched. That's it.
I know enough about the Pear O line to let me believe that they aren't that great. They are starting a second year 7th round pick at the most important spot (LT). Not sure who their LG is. Their center is a converted G that is older and paid less than the backups. The RG is a UVA bust that was supposed to be their mainstay at LT but didn't pan out. Their RT was Gay Creamy but got hurt and now starting journeyman OMYGOLLY. I know that they have given up plenty o sacks. I know that they are not doing a great job of creating running lanes. I know Jeff Cutler isn't happy with the protection he is getting and doesn't trust his O line.
Going back to Atogwe. Is he a superstar? I don't know. However, he is by far better than what we had the last couple of years with Moore and Doughty and some other fill ins.
You are delusional in thinking the Pear O line is solid. The numbers don't support it. The QB isn't happy with them. What will it take? Cutler getting injured? Another record setting year giving up sacks?
It's still early in the season and things can change. I never said the Skins were going to be a playoff team this season. You agreed. You said the Pears were going to be contenders. I said that they are mediocre. I gave my reasons why (O line, WRs, secondary). Thus, far my analysis has been more accurate than your when it comes to the Pears. You may follow them more but you have been wrong. We'll see if that changes.
I made a mistake. Williams (the UVA bust) I believe is LG. The RG was that guy Louis? that got hurt. I don't know much about him. His replacement is Chris Spencer. That pickup from Seattle. From what you said, Spencer may be better than Louis anyways. Doesn't really matter though because they both suck.
I didn't base it on one play. I watched half the game and did not see O.J. do anything other than get his holding call. That is not just 1 play, so stop making that s**t up.
Apparently he made one significant play during the game (that you told me about). Not enough to make me think much about a high priced safety that is paid like a superstar (Arch Deluxe II?)
We'll see if he is any good.
As for the Bears line - most of it is reputation. Sure the numbers are skewed because of play calling and Jay holding on to the ball too long in some cases. It is a young and relatively inexperienced line that is growing. I am very comfortable that it will be solid.
Webb started at Texas as a freshman but had to leave because of grades. Talent isn't his problem, experience is his issue. Williams is from Vandy (not UVA) and he is not a bust. Garza has been solid at center. Spencer/Louis is about the same. Carimi will be good, but Omiyale was solid against the Pack. That is the real weak spot right now. I would rather have the potential of the Bears line than the suckiness of the Deadskin line that is just plain weak. We'll see as the season progresses what happens.
Your analysis? More like urinalysis. We are 3 games in and the Bears lost to the Saints and Pack. It is not like we are struggling to beat the lowly cards at home and blowing a game against a beat up and inept Cowgirl team.
WTF, dude? You were saying that I was basing my comments on Atogwe on comments made by the MNF team. You gave me nothing other than the one holding play in a game you admittedly partially watched to form your opinion. Hypocrisy at its finest.
His body of work and his play thus far has been by far better than anything we have had since Sean Taylor was here. I'm not saying that he is as good as Sean Taylor only that he is a big upgrade to Moore/Doughty/other guys we have stuck in there.
Of course the numbers are skewed. Of course Jeff Cutler is holding on to the ball too long. Excuses, excuses. The line is not that great. The Skins line has been solid and I would gladly take that bunch over the Pear mess any day.
Williams maybe hasn't been a bust but he is a disappointment. He played his final two years in college at LT. He was drafted 14th overall and expected to be the mainstay at LT (the most important position on the line) for the next decade. Don't tell me the Pears drafted him at 14 to be a G. He failed to live up to expectations. He is a disappointment. He was beaten out by a second year 7th round pick. Disappointment.
Cutler has admitted to releasing the ball quicker because of sack fear. You can say that this is a solid group all you want. You seem to be standing alone in that line. You can have your opinions all you want but they are supported by nothing. Nice.
Did you hear O.J.'s name being called during the game? Was he making plays all over the field? The ONLY time I heard O.J.'s name was on the holding call. That doesn't mean that I am basing it on one play - that means that it is the only play where he seemed to be a factor that I saw.
I've watched parts of all three games, but I don't ever really see or hear O.J. doing anything. We'll see if he is a 30 year old superstar (he is paid like one) or a 30 year old dude who is hanging on (Arch Deluxe II). He is probably in the middle, but we'll see.
Again, I've watched more of O.J. than you have of the Bears O-line. But here is the bottom line on the Bears line - it is a young group that needs to develop. That said, there is no question in my mind that it is improved because you don't see the constant jail breaks we saw last year. As the season progresses it is a group that I expect will gel and frankly control the line of scrimmage. But we'll see.
So you want to hear his name called all the time. You heard it once on a holding call. You didn't hear it when he broke up the TD pass. You didn't hear it when he chased a RB and tackled him down the sideline. You didn't hear when the announcers said it was a good pickup. AGAIN, I'm not saying his is a perennial All Pro but he is better than what we have.
You say you haven't heard his name being called out more or seen enough plays. The last couple of years it was obvious in nearly every game the FS blowing plays (either missed tackles or blown coverages). It's a good thing if we don't hear him all the time.
He is not being paid like the top S in the league (Arch kind of money). He signed a 5 yr/$26M deal. That is less than what he signed the year before with the Rams. I don't know how much of it is guaranteed. I imagine he is paid somewhere in the top third of Safeties. His numbers support that money. Allen is known as a smart spender and doubt he would blow his wad on Atogwe the way Cerrato would have done.
We'll see if the Pears O line improves. Cutler certainly isn't happy with them.
I rarely heard OJ's name being called in the first three games. In fact I remember asking myself who is the other safety next to Doughty after week 2. I actually had to look it up. He has made one significant play in 3 weeks, but most of his play has been unremarkable. Lets see what he does against his former team, and how Haslett's defense does against his former team. It should be a fun one as well.
I like a lot of what the Deadskins have done in the off-season. They seem to have gotten rid of some of the distractions (McNabb and Haynesworth) and the choice of Kerrigan seems to be a good one.
But the team is still on the weaker side when it comes to NFL talent, and it still seems to me that their defensive personnel really would be better suited for a classic 4-3 scheme. You play Orakpo and Kerrigan at the ends, Nield, Coffield, Carriker at the DTs and Bowen can play both end and tackle. The linebackers could be solid in Rocky, Fletch, and Jackson and then you have your traditional secondary. The 3-4 still does not seem to be right for their personnel.
As for O.J. The Rams let him go rather than pay him $8M. There wasn't anywhere close to the type of contract the Deadskins gave him coming from other teams. He may end up being a difference maker, but there is a good chance that he is a high priced mistake. To not acknowledge that it is a reasonable possibility is to deny reality.
Then, you have Arsenio. Is he a difference maker or a distraction who gets burned regularly? He certainly did not show leadership this past week.
The longer term problem that I see for the Deadskins is that Shanny has never been great at talent evaluation. Allen is more of a cap guy - not a GM in the sense of managing scouts and evaluating talent.
The 2-0 start got Deadskin nation into a lathered up frenzy, but as the losses start to rack up it will probably be more of the same.
How many times do I have to repeat myself? I never said Atogwe was a perennial All Pro player. However, he is a vast improvement over what we had. I'm sorry you guys haven't heard his name enough. However, it is clear we have upgraded at that position. Don't know what else to tell you.
The personnel is MUCH better suited for the 3-4 compared to last year. Even when Osakpo was being drafted, many experts predicted him becoming a LB. Jackson as a LB? He is a converted college DE. The defense is vastly improved from last season (currently ranked 16th - BTW, Pears D ranked 25th) so I don't have a problem with the scheme/personnel. We have one of the best 3rd down defenses in the league which is huge as you want to get off of the field so your comments on the defense are largely baseless.
How do you know what Atogwe was offered by other teams? You didn't know the first thing about the guy. Again, he is not being paid as a top 5 safety. I imagine it is in the top 3rd of the league which I have no problem with.
Hall is a solid player and gets a bad wrap because he talks too much. That is his one problem. However, I don't see him as a problem guy right now. Now, if he keeps on talking then maybe he will become a problem but I don't have any problem with him and he is a guy that can play football. He locked up on Fitz the entire for 45 of 48 snaps and outside of the one deep ball held him largely in check. I'm fine with D. Hall.
Again, we are in rebuilding mode. We changed our team drastically from last season. To think that it will all come together in one season is ridiculous. Again, you have to like the direction the team is going in and hopefully we will see the improvements as the season goes on and into next season.
As far as talent evaluators, yeah that has been a knock on Shanny. However, I like the picks we made in the draft this season. Kerrigan looks very good. Jenkins was competing for a starting job until he got hurt and was getting the most praise of all the picks. Word is out on Hankerson. Helu looks solid. Gomes is a good special teamer. Paul drew a lot of praise in the preseason. Neild has produced. I'm happy with the approach and picks in the draft. A few more of those and we'll certainly improve.
No one is talking about All Pro - only you are (although he is paid like an All Pro). It just doesn't seem like he is doing much. Maybe he is an upgrade, but it is a bit early to really say one way or another.
The personnel may be better than last year for running the 3-4, but they still seem like they would be better off playing the 4-3 with the guys they have. It is going to hurt them to have to have Kerrigan and Orakpo in coverage - they are just not that good at it and it is not their strength.
When O.J. was released it was over $8M. He is getting that money from the Deadskins this year. I looked it up and there was interest for him, but no one seemed to be willing to pony up the money. Certainly there wasn't that much interest in O.J. that there was a bidding war.
Arsenio stinks and he is a malcontent.
The Deadskins are always rebuilding. Shanny has never shown himself to be much of a talent evaluator. He is going to have to change that rep if the Deadskins are really going to improve. We can agree on that.
He's not getting paid like an All Pro. That's B.S. Polamalu got a 4 year deal worth $36.5 million with $10.55 million guaranteed. Atogwe got a 5 year, $26M contract. Again, Atogwe has been in the top third at his position and is getting that type of money. What's your problem?
DeMarcus Ware and Spencer are not good at coverage. Matthews is not good at coverage. Mario Williams is not good at coverage. James Harrison is not great at coverage. Yet all are part of the 3-4. What's the point?
In June 2010, Atogwe signed a 5-year contract worth $32 million with the Rams. They cut him. We signed him for less.
D. Hall is one of the better CBs in the league and he is no malcontent. That's just B.S. that you are spewing.
The draft class is solid and it's a start at changing Shanny's opinion.
All your comments are baseless and B.S. Offer better next time.
Atogwe is making $8M this year and got almost $10M guaranteed and he is among the top 10 safeties in the NFL. We'll see if he is worth it.
That looks like All Pro numbers to me. He isn't the top but he is among the top.
Hall is a dick and you know it. If he played for the Bears I would love to hear what you would say. The B.S. he pulled after the game was typical of the kind of stuff he always says year after year.
I said what I said about the Deadskins defensive personnel in total. They seem far better suited for the 4-3. Don't just pick one element of the discussion. The Packers have a team that is well suited to play the 3-4 because they have a lot of linebackers and secondary folks who are really good. The Texans and Dallas have the linebackers and secondary to do it also. The Deadskins don't really have enough depth or the players for situational substitutions into the 3-4. They do have enough good players to play the 4-3. To me, this would be a pretty good 4-3 team, but it is a below average 3-4 team because of its personnel.
So he ranks in the top 10. I agree. We'll see if he is worth it.
He was frustrated after the game and someone shoved a mic in his face. He went off. He shouldn't have but he did. The next day, he took back his comments. He understood the call. He took responsibility. What more do you want? It would be more upsetting if he said what he said a day or two after the game when he had a chance to think about it. That is what CP and Haynesworth would do. That is what makes the situation much different. Redskins beat reporters have said that there is no carry over and even LaVar and Dukes and B-Mitch all understood the comments and don't believe there is any lasting effect. His teammates supported him so there is no problem. I really don't have any problem with what he said. If he continues to do that, my feelings may change but I actually agreed with his sentiments. To say he is a malcontent is nonsense. Haynesworth was a malcontent.
Texans and Cowboys have the personnel for that? Williams is a cover guy? Ware is a cover guy? Robs, we are the 16th ranked defense in the league (compared to 31st last season). The numbers say that we aren't below average. It's baseless B.S. I can take the kind of improvement the numbers show and what we see during games.
OK, so you agree he is a high priced safety - so I was right.
You agree that Arsenio was not very captain-like in his comments. He did not accept responsbility for the facemask.
Given the personnel, do you think the Deadskins would be better in the 4-3 or the 3-4? If you honestly think it is the 3-4 that is fine, but if not then you agree with me and STFU!
WTF is your problem? I said that he is probably paid as a top third S in the league. He is in the top 10. There are 31 other guys that play his position. I don't know if he is priced at #6 or #10. He is paid accordingly. So you're right about nothing.
I can agree that the comments weren't captain like. However, I don't agree that he is a malcontent or that he stinks. I don't necessarily agree that it was a facemask. I could have seen it called either way. From what I recall, he put his hand on the mask but it didn't get intertwined and he immediately removed his hand.
I think their personnel is fine for the 3-4 and can't say they would definitely be better in a 4-3. Based on stats, they have made dramatic improvements at defense.
So you STFU and take that molding of Rexy's dong you made and shove it up your arse!
There are 62 starting safeties and another 30-40 or so on the bench. That means he is in the top 10 percent. Do the math correctly. Any way you cut it he is one of the top paid safeties in the game.
We'll see how the Deadskin D ends up - but it looks like it could be a very good 4-3. If they end up below 21st at the end of the year, the 3-4 may be a key reason.
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